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Nintendo Switch

Discussion in 'General' started by Zacattack99, Jan 7, 2018.

?

What impresses you?

  1. Multiplayer

    2 vote(s)
    40.0%
  2. Simple and Classic Gameplay styles

    1 vote(s)
    20.0%
  3. amiibo and DIVA room.

    2 vote(s)
    40.0%
  4. The idea of Nintendo-themed Content.

    2 vote(s)
    40.0%
  5. The other stuff

    1 vote(s)
    20.0%
  6. The times today.

    3 vote(s)
    60.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    This all started from a few questionable decisions they [CFM/SEGA] made in regards to Hatsune Miku. I just think they can do much more than niché and non-straightforward cross-promotions, I’d go and take the risk with bigger, more globally recognized IPs, heck, they have the oppertunity now, they just need to do it.
     
  2. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    For a minute I want to talk about the possibility that the Nintendo Switch might offer to competetive Project DIVA players. I figure I let that rest on it’s own post...
     
  3. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #23 Zac Wood, Mar 29, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2018
    891D927F-25D9-48B9-84D1-C3B1DE5547DA.png
    This was something I was working on in Google Slides. That ZERO in the name implied starting from scratch. (I feel sorta dumb to not mention that earlier...) Multiplayer is a large focus for me, and I undergone a vigorous thinking session from 2016 up till 2017 to imagine how the HUD would look to accomodate both player’s stats while accomodating for the Switch’s 6.6 inch 720p screen. I also wanted this to be a step up [visually] from earlier games, with a more futuristic-jaggy look reminisant to High-End “Beast” PCs (and other products.). Both Basic and Classic charts will be the same as if playing alone, so note placement won’t be stupidly hard to look at. In a nutshell; they won’t change.

    • The green bars represent life.
    • The blue bars represent the “Module Drop” guage. I know people hated the mechanic in Project DIVA X, so I made it less intrusive to the point of showing the prize at the end as oppose of right in the middle of the video. (I think it should be called the “Prize Drop Guage for now on. Don’t worry, the In-Game shop is it’s own thing, I just wanted to keep things interesting.)
    • The orange bar is the obvious song duration line, with red and purple lines being Project DIVA F’s Technical and Chance Zones (Unfortunately, don’t expect video changes...)
    • HUD elements like ratings COOL. GOOD, etc. and combo numbers are placed on the Display itself. This is to accomodate with the single chart gameplay and avoid confusion.
    • I put lyrics up at the top. Why, is as a cool refference to NicoNico’s comment system, with lyrics flying from right to left in a similar fashion. (2 words, Source Material.)
    • Chart info; Song title and difficulty. Didn’t add style because this was an example. (At least Extreme+ is a better name for a difficulty than EX Extreme...)
    • The two triangular icons are to indicate who is the winning player, not much really. ( I did get it confused with The guages for F, F2nd, etc. but found a purpose for it.) These of course, are styled after the Neon Blue and Neon Red Joy-Con btw.

    You can make your own assumptions of course. Hopefully it’s clear to understand. (Finally, a screenshot and not some shaky, muddled-looking, photo of a drawing on notebook paper.)
     
  4. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #24 Zac Wood, Apr 13, 2018
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2018
  5. Bad Egg

    Bad Egg Project DIVA on Nintendo Switch plz!

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    Reminds me of the old Miiverse times when I was trying to convince everyone that Project DIVA Switch was a good idea. All those arguments are familiar, I just didn't assets nor anything because , heck, it was Miiverse.

    I'm just gonna drop this bomb here:

    Remember the time around 2014-2015 before Future Tone was ported on the PS4? In fact, wherever they ported the game or not was determined by a survey by SEGA. Japanese fans could vote for which platform they wanted to play the game on. The options were PS4, Wii U (!), Xbox One and "other devices", meaning that given the condition that if the Wii U was not a flop and fans wanted the game on Wii U more than PS4, we would have gotten Future Tone on the Wii U.
    I can't find the source of this survey anymore because all I find is actual Future Tone stuff, but I will look for it if I happen to find free time. This being said, playing Project DIVA on Nintendo platforms is possible. While the Wii U did not get this chance, the Switch can get it, according to the current circumstances of the Project DIVA series and handheld market.

    Heck, I was fine if they just continued Project mirai on the Switch. I'd even buy that April fools game if it was real. Just give me a Miku game on the Switch already!
     
  6. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #26 Zac Wood, May 19, 2018
    Last edited: May 20, 2018
    But you gotta admit, my ideas are cool.
     
  7. Bad Egg

    Bad Egg Project DIVA on Nintendo Switch plz!

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    MARVELOUS! says that they have some titles for the Switch to be announced.

    Source: http://hiro155.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-7547.html

    I hope they port IA/VT COLORFUL (and improve the charts so that they actually fit the rhythm). Joy-cons are my favorite controllers after all.
     
  8. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #28 Zac Wood, Jun 1, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2018
    After the reveal of Pokémon: Let’s Go, Pikachu! and Pokémon: Let’s Go, Eevee!; and the fact Hatsune Miku VR was essentally cannabalized by not just the reveal of Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo Switch, but Steam’s marketplace as a whole; CFM and SEGA should had already taken note of the bonanza 2018 will become for Nintendo Switch. If they decided to release a game in time for the series’ 10th anniversary, and not to be outdone by the core Pokémon games that year; it will be HUGE.
     
  9. futuretype

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    There's also the comment that Project Diva is a Playstation exclusive title (as far to my knowledge?), if there was going to be another game for switch the best bet would be for Project Mirai, since it released on 3DS and already accustomed itself to Nintendo's control scheme.
    There is no need for all this over the top speculation, just make another Mirai game for Nintendo Switch. Stick to where it started, and is best known.

    Also what's all the argument of spreading Miku's popularity I seen? She doesn't need to be on Nintendo to be popular or anything, obviously as her games started on Playstation consoles and despite her appearance in video games, she's already insanely popular. :P
     
  10. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    To futuretype;

    Project Mirai was actually it’s own main series game; but the 3DS screen resoulution and such sent it into spin-off territory. It would make sense to make it to Switch since the series was (a poorly marketed) PlayStation exclusive because of Cross-Play, and it wouldn’t make sense anymore with the PS Vita being extinct outside of Japan and the PS4’s life reaching it’s final phase with the future of PS5 still a mystery. Since the Switch is unique enough as is fufilling and successful; why not push a main-series game on it?

    When you compare Miku to Mario in terms of both name and brand recognition, you will see why Hatsune Miku X Nintendo should had happened years ago. Miku appeared as a popular side character in a japanese animated series about trains in space, while Mario is seeing a life on the big screen through Dispicable Me’s Illumination Entertainment, and in Universal theme parks. If more stuff like the David Letterman Show appearence were happened more often in the west, combined with something in the degree of pairing with Mario; I’d be singing a different tune. (No pun intended.) The way I see it: Mario making a prominent appearence and acting as the personification of Prime Minister Shinzo Abe in Rio 2016’s closing ceremony, and fans demanding Miku to appear in London 2012’s opening ceremony to no avail is the biggest example of the reality challenging that ‘Insanely popular’ notion with Miku, it’s true in Japan; but not by much in the west.
     
  11. futuretype

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    #31 futuretype, Jun 5, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2018
    Vaguely, I understand your point. But saying that Miku is not as popular in the west is simply ridiculous.
    Asides from being on Letterman show, in 2016, Miku Expo hosted multiple successful concerts in North America, and it's even coming back this year to do more. Speaking of that, why would Miku get a proper English voicebank if not for the creators who have been tuning her original voicebank to sound like she is speaking English for YEARS? And why would they officially promote so many English songs and creators, especially for this years Miku Expo?
    If you've ever been on the internet regardless of what side you're on, I'd be pretty surprised if you haven't heard of Miku or even known of her popularity. I might understand a little, if you told me you had been living under a rock for the past ten years. But she has merch in many stores in America, so even if you're not online you'd atleast have seen her face before.

    Not to mention, that Project Diva games are just as popular here as well, holding their value YEARS after they come out in game stores where I'm lucky to even find a copy. It's also been noted by other fans that the American releases fly off the shelves as fast as they're put on. Plus, why would Project Diva even get a localized release consistently as it does if it didn't sell well here?

    Again, I reinforce my statement about Project Mirai coming to Switch. Yes, it's very different from Diva, but how could it not be when the controllers are set up differently? If you've ever played Diva, you must know how ingrained the games controls and techniques are to the very controller you play it on. With it's release on 3DS, Mirai integrated itself just as well to the controls it was given, as Diva did with the Playstation. So for that reason, why would you change Diva so much just to fit it on the Switch, when Mirai already has all of that figured out? Heck, Mirai is able to emulate a lot of similiar technique and skill that's needed in Diva in it's own unique way on the 3DS.

    By the way, all the Diva games that are on the Vita are on main consoles, so it doesn't matter if the Vita isn't as popular here. If the Vita dies, Diva will continue to thrive because none of them are Vita exclusive (afaik).
    To conclude, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.
     
  12. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #32 Zac Wood, Jun 6, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2018
    To reinforce my own statements:

    Despite everything you just mentioned; the brand itself is only popular to that niche audience of content creators and content connoisseurs. I am looking at Miku at a businessman's and a outsider’s perspective; take the average joe and introduce the character as merchandise without mentioning the name or what Hatsune Miku is; they will afiliate it with anime and nothing else. Using the terms typical, anime, affiliating, and Miku in the same sentence is upsetting, if not insulting to some fans, but that’s how I see it if one was to find merchandise and not look at anything else. I’m still bringing up the Tokyo 2020 teaser with Mario because again; while Miku is by some definition; insanely popular, the character not to the point of popularity Mario has, and will raise in the coming years in movies and theme parks.


    Keeping the Project DIVA series exclusive to the PS4 is a terrible idea. The original was designed for the PSP and with the portable Japanese player demographic in mind. These people are used to pick-up-and-play sessions in short bursts, and subsequent instalments expanded on this to the western audience who indulge on mobile. While the hardcore VOCALOID fan may prefer the sameness with prettier eyecandy to gawk at; it won’t work in the means to make ‘new’ fans, and helps bring the point across to who Hatsune Miku actually is.


    While Project Mirai is by and large Nintendo-tailored; for the Switch, it’s the worst possible, proper debut for Hatsune Miku if CFM is trying to go in hard on Nintendo’s latest and arguably greatest platform. Since the console is meant to cater to the casual pick-up-and-play type in addition to those who have a lot of time on their hands with a TV, it’s essentially perfect. Project Mirai maybe Nintendo-tailored, but it was 3DS tailored, and was disliked by fans because of its artistic departure, which was because of the 3DS’s screen resolution. The Switch home console is different from from the 3DS handheld despite the portability, so that doesn't guarantee a faithful translation in theory.


    On the topic on ‘arguably greatest platform’; It be for the better to go hard because of success of the system itself. The Switch is already garnished somewhere around 20 million units with in over 1 year. The upcoming library is definitely going to push more millions; Fortnite is as good as confirmed for Switch despite the clandestine lack of fanfare from Epic Games. Following suit is Super Smash Bros. and Pokémon Let’s Go Pikachu! & Eevee!, all due to come out in 2018. Don’t tell me that a core Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA game isn’t worth developing for Nintendo Switch, a console with that big a line-up.


    To what the Nintendo Switch might do to improve while staying true to the game formula is also enticing to the developer. One thing that can be done is 2-player Multiplayer using single Joy-Con, and expand on that to Miku fans that are more competitive, adding the live concerts social element that has been lost with the series since it’s inception. Nintendo might allow the use of their I.P.s in Module, Accessory, Song, or PV form. Like with the Sonic Style Module; let’s a already popular I.P. give Miku a themed spotlight. That is essentially what I would do in their case to innovate. (You should of looked at the over-pontification of my ideas.)


    After 2-3 years of analysis and research, with a little bit of time spent; that’s what I came up with. It’s not pretty; but it’s anything regarding sales and money that tells me that Hatsune Miku’s fate with Project DIVA is Nintendo Switch. It’s more than fan desire, and that’s that.
     
  13. Doctopus

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    #33 Doctopus, Jun 10, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2018
    I am still not sure why you would have the single JoyCon co-op idea. You could use 2 Switches and get much better gameplay. Single JoyCon scheme may work really well on fighting games but such scheme just feels really unnatural on rhythm games and either locks players to the casual difficulty or creates an unplayable mess (again see the first PD game). If the reason is just for maximizing the use of Switch hardware and not for improving player experience then I would say that it is probably not worth it due to the fact that you might waste a lot of R&D power to create something that nobody wants.

    Also the Nintendo-centric thing might work poorly as well. For example, think about Sanrio. They have a globally recognized IP, Hello Kitty. However the other members in the Sanrio family are still somewhat "underappreciated" (not so popular as Hello Kitty e.g. merch for Hello Kitty are everywhere in any form you can imagine, but not so for other characters, although Sanrio did advertised them and try to make the link), not to mention Show By Rock series which everybody else outside Japan thinks about "upsetting anime" instead of big, mighty Sanrio IP. Same thing could happen on this PD0 as well. It might draw some Nintendo fans' attention but they may just there for more Mario but not Miku, which is not what you want to achieve. Sure sales wise it may look good but our Miku is still "not famous among general audience WW" and left rotten inside the "niche market".

    Also Switch itself is far from "perfect" as a gaming platform despite its success sales-wise: No hard drive support, no any means of backing up the save data and worse, bricks itself for stupid reasons so you lose your 100+ hrs of hard work. As a player I don't want my work to be treated as something disposible. Also the control scheme is generally weird for mainstream rhythm games. You could ask for rhythm game players' opinion on tactile buttons (e.g. PSVita, 3DS) and/or asymmetric button layout (e.g. 3DS, Switch, Xbox <anything>) and I'm sure a lot of them didn't like it. (although you could be "innovate" and bypass the restriction by developing something like a Miku dancing game, which e.g. uses the JoyCon camera to record players' pose or just use the touchscreen like all the mobile games did)

    So TL;DR:

    Please don't. Study the culture and game designing further and gain some practical experience before you design. This makes your idea more implementable, profitable and more likely to pass the players' test.
     
  14. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #34 Zac Wood, Jun 17, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 18, 2018
    The whole Idea is creating a more casual oriented playstyle in addition to something veterans are used to. If the SEGA feat. HATSUNE MIKU Project were able to create Project Mirai’s touch based rhythm game as a competent alternative for button controls, then I have faith it will work. Besides; if you have a friend that wants to jump in but dosen’t have a Switch on hand; (or something like a Pro Controller or 2 Joy-Con and a Joy-Con Grip in that matter.) then it makes sense for playing the game casually.

    Some of these fans are also some well known VOCALOID artists. Did you ever see (Rin-Chan-Now artist) Owata-P’s obscure “VOCALOID PETIT THEATRE”?, Did you ever see the just as obscure Go Go Mario remix and Super Turkish March? He also does alot of Splatoon livestreams for both games. Halyosy Mosy hid a Mario-themed easter egg in BLESSINGS at the 2:52 mark. With Jesus-P and Remote Control’s original video; it was famous for replacing the Famicom controller with the Dreamcast controller when making the DIVA version. All and all there’s some passion that some of these people have with something like Mario and Splatoon, if having that content in a Project DIVA rhythm game was a thing; then it be doing content creators and artists a favor, and not just fans that listen and watch.

    To SEGA’s credit there is proof to back this up; and fans of the Sonic Style Miku Module are enough proof. There’s the Sonic ROM hack; “Miku the DIVA in Sonic 1”; replacing Sonic with Miku in said Module, and [the infamous] TrackerTD expanded on the concept with a Sonic Mania mod; complete with it’s own cutscenes, story, and major level edits. So famous Nintendo properties, in that manner; will work well, I would talk about Fire Emblem’s modern success being thanks to Super Smash Bros. Melee, or Nintendo’s current I.P. Agenda with Comcast in theme parks or movies, but I will leave it at that.

    I have doubts about anything other than Project DIVA being appropriate for Switch. Alot of alternative Miku-centric games always fall short in terms of repetiveness, over-gimmicky-ness, and being cheap in both quality and content. I am reffering to Miku Miku Hockey for the PS Vita and the recently released Hatsune Miku VR on PC. Despite the option to work on something else; Project DIVA get’s the most attention and success. Even though the series can be considered perfect in terms of gameplay; everything else is to suppliment it with the well-needed, competitive multiplayer modes, and the easier-to-grasp control difficulty option. It’s all about options to tailor to people that can choose to play the game their own way, at their own pace. If you choose to play the game the way it’s always been; you can do that, like wise with playing the game with someone else and playing the game tailored to a simplified control scheme.


    When comparing Miku fan culture to what I came up with along with Project DIVA and the Nintendo Switch system, I believe that it is perfect. The Multiplayer, simpler control mode and combined with the Switch being easy to pick up and play, perfectly matches the social nature of Miku-themed conventions and casual fans who want to take the plunge, have a Nintendo Switch, too busy to do so, can’t handle the series’ often difficult gameplay, can’t afford having a combonation PS4/PS Vita, or have the patience to play the game later at home. Already mentioned; there’s well known VOCALOID artists of all types that are fans of Nintendo, and would be honored to work on something mixing two things they love. I understand appealing to existing players that would buy this game, but again; I want to get more people outside of that.

    I see no reasons why they can’t add more to the already existing gameplay. They got the fan-service and player-base down, but it’s all about adapting and gaining newcomers, that to me at least, shouldn’t be ignored if they want to keep things relevant. I hope to see that SEGA does something to at least address the Switch’s existence, and apoealing to the system’s strength and player-base with not trying to segregate it as a spin-off.
     
  15. Bad Egg

    Bad Egg Project DIVA on Nintendo Switch plz!

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    To come back to Miku's "Western" popularity:
    You only mentioned the situation in America. But that's not how it is in Europe, Australia and Oceania. I'm from Germany and almost nobody here, besides those who visit anime conventions, have ever heard of Hatsune Miku. And nobody there watches David Letterman, so don't think that what happens in America is what the entire West talks about. So far, only Project DIVA F 2nd and Project mirai DX had a physical release. Not sure how it was in other countries, but in Germany, the copies were limited like 10k pieces and you only could get one if you pre-ordered from GameStop or got a used one.
    And we don't have any merchandise being sold outside of special anime stores because Wal-Mart and such do only work in America. No ordinary German shop sells Miku merch, even if they sell anime merch.
    Another thing why Miku's games won't establish in Europe is the language barrier. How many languages are there in Europe? 20? Unless you are a hardcore otaku, you won't enjoy a video game if you don't understand the language. Those Germans, Russians, Finns, Mexicans and other people are those who got good marks at their English classes. And how many gamers and otakus from non-English countries have had good English marks? - A niche.
     
    Zac Wood likes this.
  16. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    Thanks for noting that out.
     
  17. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #37 Zac Wood, Jun 19, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2018
    After looking at a hot take video by Luis Alamilla which looked at SONY’s buttheaded decision with Cross-Play, and the Epic accounts, I believe this is another point in making a Switch-exclusive main-series game, not only that; but even skipping SONY’s console entirely. With the Switch being essentally a larger, more powerful and more user-friendly PS Vita, it could of made sense to have a PS4 version and exchange data between the two via the internet. With what just happened, that will never happen. Besides it will still be costly; more costly than buying the PS4 and the Vita with it’s essentals with a cross-play enabled game, but that is not as cheap as buying a Switch, the essentals needed, and with a game of choice.

    Here’s some food for thought; or (if you preffer) brain food in that manner:

    Extra Credits - (Season 8, Episode 20:) Why the PS Vita Failed


    Clean Prince Gaming - The PS VITA Didn’t Just Die | It Was Murdered


    Blake The Nerd - Could Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Future Tome Come To Nintendo Switch? (Valuable DIVA Dev FACTOIDs about Project Mirai here!)


    Luis Alamilla - PlayStation Blocks Fortnite Crossolay on Nintendo Switch and Xbox | Gaming Hot Take (aka: what brought me to doing this:)


    If your Doctopus; here’s where my blithe insight/buisnessman’s outlook comes from. Here’s a tech geek with a beard and a blue fuzzball who dealed with death: twice.)

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCoIXnB865l9Ex9zs4OIXTdQ
    https://www.youtube.com/user/ArloStuff

    Here’s DAsonicfan and [the Miku fans’ worst enemy:] TrackerTD just because. (Or you want to witness what Sonic Mania & Hatsune Miku is.)

    https://www.youtube.com/user/DAsonicfan
    https://www.youtube.com/user/TrackerTDGaming
     
  18. Doctopus

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    Quick clarification: I didn't say that having a PD series game on Switch is impossible. In fact, it is actually pretty likely that SEGA will do or is doing a Miku game (whether or not PD) on Switch because of its success. The problem exists in the details of your assumption, paticular "implementation" and how likely it will reach your goal of "make Miku more successful among general audiences over the world". Even if you have the power of the producers, you will still loop inside the niche market or get the opposite of what you want: draw Vocaloid fans into the Nintendo world (or that's what you really want. No offense, just because it makes sense). Again sales-wise it may looks good, but still far from making Miku popular among general audiences (not to mention the existence of culture differences could make things harder by an order of magnitude). Also, a good idea could fall apart easily without a good implementation. There are already countless examples of this.

    Also PSVita isn't as powerful as it seemed to be. The "spec" by Sony looked great but everything is heavily underclocked to the level that it performs roughly like a New 3DS. (with proprietary, overpriced memory cards that have the crappiest quality you can imagine)
     
  19. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    #39 Zac Wood, Jun 19, 2018
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2018
    That’s why I called the Switch a larger, more powerful, and more user-friendly PS Vita, and that’s just looking at the system as a handheld.

    I still believe the otherway around.
     
  20. Zac Wood

    Zac Wood Hatsune Miku: Project DIVA Zero, sole designer

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    Now I am just going to say one thing at a time; on it’s own thread, like with how I created a multiplayer specific thread, I had put it upon myself to introducing the latest thing I had brainstorming for the last few days, and leaving it as another standalone thread.

    The hypothetical Project DIVA Zero for Nintendo Switch: Story Mode(s?)

    https://projectdiva.net/community/t...a-zero-for-nintendo-switch-story-mode-s.1774/
     

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